Cider99869 hours ago
The 8th highest voted HN submission is on mechanical watches. I imagine that's the type the watchmaking school involves themself with because afaik all high end watches are mechanical.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31261533 4 years ago 413 comments
They have a certain beauty in their intricate details working together for function. I do really like looking at the glass back which shows some details and you can see the piece that move to gain power.
Although it seems youd have to pay a lot to get an accurate one because I have a $250 mechanical Seiko and its time keeping is junk. It was mediocre when I got it and has gotten worse. It was $150 when I bought it so I suppose it would have been a good investment if it hadn't got beat up.
piskov5 hours ago
That’s why I eventually settled with gshock that has solar charging and syncs time twice a day with radio towers (or bluetooth if you are somewhere in the world where there is no time radio signal)
Even rolex needs time setting, servicing to lube and clean metal parts, etc.
Gshock on the other hand will work for 10-15 years without a single manual time adjustment or battery swap needed.
Absolute unit.
This gold metal square one I especially love for summer:
https://www.casio.com/content/dam/casio/product-info/locales...
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epihelix7 hours ago
> Although it seems youd have to pay a lot to get an accurate one because I have a $250 mechanical Seiko and its time keeping is junk. It was mediocre when I got it and has gotten worse. It was $150 when I bought it so I suppose it would have been a good investment if it hadn't got beat up.
You know you need to service mechanical watches regularly, right?
A 7S26 movement (Seiko's mass-produced budget workhorse) isn't that accurate (I think -35 to +45s per day IIRC?). But if you paid $250 secondhand you most likely have a 6R15 or similar inside, which should keep between -15s to +25s per day at worst if regularly serviced. Often you can get much better performance from these movements than the specs imply.
But ... you need to service that poor thing. For a 6R15, every 5 years at minimum, but as an old watchmaker I knew used to say -- a watch will tell you if it needs servicing earlier. Sounds like yours has been trying to get your attention for some time :)
(Otherwise, it's like complaining that the Porsche you haven't taken to a mechanic in the last decade doesn't drive so well any more ...)
You will never get quartz accuracy from any mechanical watch, but that's hardly the point.
(The ETA 2824-2 movement in the page you linked to -- the movement that powers most mid-range mechanical watches -- is substantially more accurate than these lower-range Seiko movements, although it's more costly as well.)
ubermonkey25 minutes ago
>You know you need to service mechanical watches regularly, right?
Mostly, yeah, but I have some nicer pieces that have been in my rotation for decades with only the barest minimum of services. Like, I think my Omega (ca. 1998) has been serviced maybe once, and it keeps great time.
gleenn7 hours ago
If you are using a mechanical watch to keep time (accurately for long) you are doing it wrong
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sodastar3 hours ago
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AdamN7 hours ago
> all high end watches are mechanical.
No, most high end male jewelry are mechanical watches (and much of women-oriented jewelry as well).
High end watches are such a solved problem we don't even talk about them anymore. Either the G-shock, the Garmin watches, or the Apple Watch run circles around mechanical watches in terms of functionality with each satisfying a different niche (100% self-contained, long lived smart functionality, glance-oriented integration with full-stack personal tech ecosystem).
titanomachy7 hours ago
I think most people when they hear "high-end watch" picture some sort of mechanical jewelry watch. When G-shocks, Garmins, and Apple Watches are a few hundred dollars and well-known luxury watch brands start at a few thousand, it's reasonable to consider the latter more "high end".
Personally I'm not interested in owning a luxury watch, I like the Garmin ones.
rcxdude6 hours ago
I think they were specifically bristling at the implication that 'high-end' was mainly relating to price as opposed to functionality. The most expensive watches are expensive for reasons of fashion while being inferior in terms of functionality.
ubermonkey24 minutes ago
That's what "high end" means.
Affric6 hours ago
My Apple Watch has 3 days of battery tops.
nkrisc5 hours ago
You don’t buy an Apple Watch for its battery life, you buy it for its many other features.
If battery life is important there are other much better options.
palijer3 hours ago
Garmin venu series has 10 days which I love.
mschuster915 hours ago
> The most expensive watches are expensive for reasons of fashion while being inferior in terms of functionality.
... and for reasons of money laundering and tax evasion, similar to artwork but even better suited. No customs official anywhere will flag and interrogate you about the watch on your wrist, the younger ones probably won't even know if you're having a watch worth six figures on your wrist or some cheap knockoff.
titanomachy4 hours ago
I don’t know why you’re being downvoted. Any dense, non-perishable store of value will be eventually used in this way.
Someone4 hours ago
> When G-shocks, Garmins, and Apple Watches are a few hundred dollars and well-known luxury watch brands start at a few thousand,
The price of the most expensive Garmin a quick internet search gave me is $3,100; the most expensive G-SHOCK €8,800 ⇒ IMHO, G-SHOCK definitely is a luxury brand.
Apple Watches, relative to those, are cheap at €999 max.
b1122 hours ago
And regardless, Apple products aren't "luxury" anything. They're just computing products, with a range of buildout from low to high. Not a single thing Apple has ever made has been in the luxury category.
They're more like VW. A range of products low to high, but more expensive than domestics.
Luxury cars, luxury products are typically hand made, extremely niche. Apple is certainly not niche market.
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kazinator7 hours ago
Antrax lead guitarist Dan Spitz went on to become a watch maker:
pfdietz2 hours ago
I would have expected guitar repair. One of my recent youtube channel finds was a young woman who repairs old guitars, rewinding pickups and such. Fascinating. I didn't realize one of the uses for Formvar (aside from films for use in electron microscopes) was insulation on electric guitar pickup wires.
MarceliusK4 hours ago
There is something pleasantly backwards about a school teaching people to repair objects that were designed to last, while so much of the rest of the economy is optimized around replacement
legends2kan hour ago
It's promising and I'm glad to hear such a depth-oriented study of making things, taking time is still a thing in a fast world. People are paying to study this, nice
bell-cot28 minutes ago
Yes, but notice the scale - 20 students, in a nation of 40+ million people.
We might call that a moral or poetic victory - but practically speaking, it's like an endangered human language which "still has over 100 native speakers". The future ain't looking good.
sleepyguy13 hours ago
My grandfather was a master watchmaker and jeweler who learned his trade in the Soviet Union and then in Europe. After emigrating to Toronto after the war, he opened his own jewelry store, where he repaired watches and clocks, as well as crafted and repaired fine jewelry.
He was a true master of his craft and built a successful business based on his exceptional skill. He Was well known for his craftsmanship and his remarkable ability to repair virtually any watch or clock, no matter how complex.
Jewelers from across the city would bring him pieces that no one else could repair. For antique and vintage timepieces, he would often fabricate tiny replacement parts by hand when originals were no longer available. When he retired, very large companies would still come to his home to repair incredibly expensive pieces. He liked to tinker and would quietly work in his little home shop, pipe burning, radio playing, and visitors coming throughout the day to have him fix things.
When he passed, he had 10's of 1000's of watch parts in all these little bags that were all tagged and in boxes. We ended up giving them away to one of his customers who own several Jewelry stores. Had I known I would have offered them to this school along with 100's of watches he kept for parts.
p1necone13 hours ago
My father was a watchmaker. Fond memories of going with him in his van to the various jewellers he did work for picking up and dropping off. I remember being given a big metal lamp from his workshop when he passed away and realising the body of the lamp was not isolated from the incoming power, although luckily not at mains voltage (not what killed him).
MarceliusK4 hours ago
Fond memories and a slightly terrifying electrical inheritance
brador9 hours ago
Maybe it was a touch lamp? (Like a clapper but works when you touch the body not through sound)
p1necone8 hours ago
Not unless touch lamps are supposed to give you an electric shock :)
brador8 hours ago
Some of the older/cheaper touch lights did/do give a slight shock! It was a different time lol
MarceliusK4 hours ago
The image of him in the home shop with the radio playing and people still bringing him supposedly unfixable things is wonderful
culopatin10 hours ago
Is this still a viable career?
Someone4 hours ago
I would think so, in the same way instrument maker or painting maintenance can be careers: not for many, but a decent career for a few aficionados.
It’s not likely to employ millions of people, but there will be demand from people with serious money. For instrument making, research labs will need specialized glass parts, for example; for painting maintenance, museums have a need to keep their centuries-old pieces in the best condition. For watches, if you pay a few million for a watch, paying 10k a year for maintenance should not be a problem. For that money, you can make a decent living of 20 customers a year in many countries.
WillAdams2 hours ago
Availability of parts is something of an issue --- couldn't get my father's 27-jewel Seiko repaired for want of parts, and still trying to justify the expense of either salvaging from another watch or paying someone to fabricate a replacement part.
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cik10 hours ago
It depends on what you consider viable, and your level.
As someone in love with fountain pens and ink, I can tell you that there are absolutely wealthy pen turners, private designers, and the same with watches.
noufalibrahim9 hours ago
I'm glad fountain pens came up here. There's a shop a few hours away from where I stay in an old town in India called the "Pen Hospital". It was a thriving business in the 60s when my father went to college. Lots of people came there mostly to repair fountain pens. He's mostly just a stationery store right now but if you take a fountain pen there for repair, he does it for free just as a nod to the tradition I guess.
cik6 hours ago
My dream is to visit this store. I've heard that it's by far the greatest modern fountain pen store in the world. I'm dying to go, just for this. I've ordered from them before - all the way to Canada and Israel. A gem, might be my favourite store in the world.
noufalibrahim3 hours ago
I don't know if that's the same. There's another here called Kim and Co. which makes ebonite pens without fillers. They became popular via. social media and a lot of people ordered pens from them. Perhaps that's the one you're referring to?
cik2 hours ago
No, I'm referring to Pen Hospital in Kolkata: https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/kolkata-pen-hospital. By ordered, I mean had friends who have stumbled across it and brought me things. If there were a website mind you.
I don't have the socials, so I don't see things like what you mentioned.
ricardobayes8 hours ago
My friend told me when he visited India that they repair everything over there: it's a beautiful thing IMO
noufalibrahim8 hours ago
That's an exaggeration. Things are not as repairable as they used to be and people are not as thrifty as they used to be. However, I do think the culture of repairing things is strong and mostly financially motivated.
crdrost10 hours ago
I mean people do make a living doing it, but my understanding is that it requires a lot of hustle—as a hobbyist you can just take your time and meditate and take a million pictures, but if you're trying to make a living you have to focus on volume, volume, volume... So you have to have a system, this one goes in the cleaner and you are immediately disassembling the next, another is in a tray next to the machine that tells you how fast or slow it's ticking... It is maybe less glamorous than it first sounds.
culopatin10 hours ago
Can one end up working for TAG out of this for example? What does it take for that career ladder to happen?
nkapias6 hours ago
To my understanding it depends mostly on the applicant age.
Watchmaking can take a heavy toll on eyesight, due to working with magnifying glasses on tiny parts during decades. Also each brand has unique processes and machinery, for which they have expensive learning courses.
Thus they would rarely consider applicants past their forties even if they have experience and favorable relations.
AdamN7 hours ago
Probably going to the school above is a good start.
sodastar8 hours ago
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edm0nd8 hours ago
highly doubtful if it was your career and you are just starting
probably would make more $ from it if you were a YouTuber or TikTok creator and did "watchmaking" content.
LzeYing13 hours ago
I believe this is exactly the kind of high-paying job that is difficult for AI to replace.
seemaze12 hours ago
Mechanical timepieces are a luxury item, and these students are essentially artists in training. Wrist time was solved in the late 1970's with the commoditization of quartz movements. These 'jobs' will get replaced by AI at approximately the same pace as your local sculptor.
Analemma_12 hours ago
I don't know if watchmaking is one of them, but there are a bunch of traditional crafts which are actually approaching a danger point because there aren't enough up-and-coming acolytes in the discipline to replace them, even though the craft still enjoys enough popular support to have a thriving economy.
Anecdotally, I see enough mechanical watches on wrists and in duty-free shops that I imagine there's enough of a pipeline there for at least one school. Much like vinyl records it doesn't appear to actually be going away even if it's superfluous.
WillAdams2 hours ago
Good example of that is engraving:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH3MtWln2Og
(ages ago, I was in touch with a person who described himself as "the last hand engraver in New York City" when considering an apprenticeship --- couldn't commit to the move --- always wondered if he found a successor)
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LzeYing11 hours ago
Come to think of it, it makes sense; in this day and age, every industry is evolving so rapidly that the future remains quite uncertain.
annzabelle12 hours ago
I have a friend who got an English and Creative Writing degree from a liberal arts college, and then immediately went back to trade school for band instrument repair. It's not particularly lucrative, as trades go, but it does seem a lot more future proof than most careers.
hn_throwaway_9910 hours ago
I recently left my career as a software engineer to train to become a violin maker. Couldn't be happier.
LzeYing11 hours ago
Haha, so you're going to do something AI can't replace, right?
annzabelle11 hours ago
Thinking about it. I'm pretty attracted to the idea of a career with some kind of protectionist licensing system, like doctor or actuary, but that may just be staving off the inevitable. Might teach high school.
After I got laid off in the US, I moved to a mountain town in New Zealand planning on being a ski lift operator while I think about the future, but got a software developer job by accident instead.
loloquwowndueo2 hours ago
Taxis had a protectionist system. Took a single competitor with deep pockets and disregard for the system to upend the whole thing.
gleenn7 hours ago
Correct, AI will not replathe 3 high-paying watch maker jobs that exist. You are the best kind of correct, technically. But you are distracting from the fact that most people aren't doing anything even remotely physical related in the space that some people posit will be decimated by AI: white-collar jobs where you are a keyboard jockey all day.
stouset12 hours ago
Sure but it’s also a microscopically small component of the country’s overall economy.
zuzululu12 hours ago
canada's economy is roughly slightly below Mississipi with increasing amount of migration from third world countries putting strain on its resources and with almost no plans other than to tax the already overstretched middle class
its almost the exact dilemma in Western Europe except the only saving grace is military security is guaranteed by its larger and richer neighbor
wasabi99101111 hours ago
> canada's economy is roughly slightly below Mississipi
No, it isn't. Not true in absolute terms, not true per capita, not true adjusted for purchasing power.
vlovich1239 hours ago
It is true per capita in USD dollars due to the weak Canadian dollar. Mississippi has better purchasing power
wasabi991011an hour ago
No, it isn't, at least according to here [1] (data from worldbank). This is in nominal USD as almost all calculations of GDP. If you compare by purchasing power, Canada likely pulls out ahead since Canada has a lower price level than the US [2] (can't find Mississippi-specific price level).
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territ... section "U.S. states by GDP per capita if they were sovereign states"
vlovich123an hour ago
You can’t just say “no it isn’t” when your own link disagrees with you.
From your link per capita GDP for Mississippi $55,877 in 2025 compared with $60,305 in 2026 for Canada [1]. That seems pretty similar.
My point was that when the Canadian dollar is weak GDP in USD decreases while when it’s strong GDP increases without anything about the country’s output changing - that’s the challenging of comparing by normalizing against a single currency.
I’ll let you do your own purchasing power math but Mississippi has significantly cheaper prices as part of America than Canada. Canada has a stronger safety net but that isn’t about purchasing power to much other than health insurance being baked into your taxes.
g8oz2 minutes ago
When I see these GDP comparisons between Mississippi and Europe or Canada I have to ask does anyone honestly believe that life in Mississippi is better than in any of those other two places? Especially if you have any knowledge of Mississippi. If anything this example shows us the limitations of using this statistic.
zuzululu8 hours ago
absolutely. its the "poorest" state too
sanswork12 hours ago
Canada's GDP is $2.2t vs $165b for Mississippi. Immigration rate is decreasing.
zuzululu10 hours ago
thanks for bringing this up and I have to reiterate the importance of per capita which is something that is curiously ignored in these discussions but I'm sure you know the difference from just measuring GDP alone and just forgot about it
Canada's nominal GDP per capita is roughly $53,800 USD, which places it nearly on par with Mississippi
also Canada admits people from third world countries at a per-capita rate roughly four times higher than the United States, with none of the enforcement agencies capable of tackling illegal immigration which a lot of this demographic engages in. It's difficult for ICE now imagine Canada which has no such enforcement on the same scale
my point is that Canada has a smaller economy but imports more from the third world than its much richer and powerful neighbor.
this is not a sustainable arrangement.
jollyllamaan hour ago
> It's difficult for ICE now imagine Canada which has no such enforcement on the same scale
A massive federal agency rounding up illegal immigrants actually isn't that effective, as has been seen in the USA. What actually works is making it impossible to find a job or housing without proof of citizenship - which is being done in Canada BTW
cwillu6 hours ago
If you don't say the words “per capita”, you don't get credit for having said them.
watwut4 hours ago
And still, Canada has higher living standards, better healthcare, school system, criminal justice and lower murder rates.
No, Canada is not as poor as Missisipy.
ipaddr12 hours ago
Canada ranks 4th.
https://www.visualcapitalist.com/how-canada-would-rank-as-th...
physicalecon10 hours ago
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bparsons5 hours ago
The Canada hater has logged on.
Cthulhu_8 hours ago
Yes, and it's a great example of an industry that was completely decimated by automation - you can get a functional watch for a fiver, whereas back when every watch was handmade and a de-facto inheritance piece.
But bespoke, handmade, high value, low volume stuff is still around.
jameshart11 hours ago
I am literally wearing a watch right now that was produced without any of these artisans’ specialized labor and which boasts among its features access to AI.
In a very real sense I have replaced use of the skills of watchmakers with AI.
Sorry about that. To be fair most watchmakers were already put out of work by quartz oscillators and integrated circuits in the 1980s.
shit_game8 hours ago
The reason that you bought your watch and the reason that other people buy these hand crafted mechanical watches are very, very different. Once upon a time, utility used to be what necessitated an accurate movement, and it came at great cost because of the skill, knowledge, precision, and artistic talent needed to make one; this justified further embellishing the movement with a beautiful case and band because it would be in poor taste to make something that is both expensive and ugly when your primary consumers would be aristocrats. Eventually timepieces became commodified as industrialization made their manufacture feasible at a larger scale, and later then the advent of the quartz crystal made mechanical movements functionally obsolete as a means of telling time accurately. Approaching perfect timekeeping in a mechanical movement is not meant to be utilitarian, but rather a practice in artistry. Mechanical watches are jewelry, and jewelry irrationally commands the price that any luxury does because it's a matter of taste and not utility. Nobody buying a Patek Philippe is doing so because they want millisecond accuracy via atmoic clock GPS signals - they buy Seikos for that.
DiscourseFan7 hours ago
I think the fact that you can have a compact device on your wrist that accurately keeps time all without any battery or circuitry is really remarkable as well. Moreover that the “technology superior” smart watches are kind of distracting and don’t have a great deal of use value. My watch tells the time and the date, that’s really all I need it for
kasey_junk4 hours ago
Yet most people in the watch industry will suggest that the Apple Watch was a boon for the industry because it retrained people to wear a watch, a fashion that was being abandoned.
soperj11 hours ago
you need AI to tell the time?
rvba9 hours ago
Suprising amount of people do not know how to read time from the "classical" watches and clocks (those with hands).
Reason is very simple - they dont own clocks with hands when theh are kids.
Cthulhu_7 hours ago
Not knowing is fine, but a refusal to learn is not. I think that's the major issue with first social media / short attention span content, modern media over-explaining stuff, and nowadays with AI. Even if they get an answer from AI they won't take it in, just pass it on / read it out / apply it to whatever they're doing now and promptly forget it.
(I'm generalizing / being a cranky old man and I'm not even that old)
netsharc7 hours ago
But... this is a condition that can be changed within 1 minute? (From "do not know" to "know").
Sure it takes longer to get proficient, but learning it is quicker than learning e.g. Roman numerals or how to tie a necktie.
keiferski10 hours ago
Not really. No one wants a Rolex or Omega with ChatGPT in it.
ricardobayes8 hours ago
I don't know how high paying it is, although I can see how it can be, especially given there is a shortage of watchmakers in the developed world, even in Switzerland.
Cthulhu_7 hours ago
Is that because of a lack of interest or because the requirements and education required are just very high level and specialised?
keiferski10 hours ago
Basically anything that is a luxury good is probably safe from AI. If people are buying it for status or high performance reasons, they aren’t going to pick the low end AI slop version.
numbersfollow6712 hours ago
Unless they’re replaced by humans controlled by AI(look at the various research for BCIs or for gene therapy that allows for the possibility for you to be controlled by radio frequencies), then they’re very easily replaced.
matheusmoreira10 hours ago
> gene therapy that allows for the possibility for you to be controlled by radio frequencies
What. Can you cite this research?
1413 hours ago
As a Canadian cool! Never heard of this school before but on the west coast so probably why.
I've watched many watch repair videos online and the knowledge base required is huge. Also there are many tools needed which are not cheap. There is just so much to know that takes years to learn. Very cool that the knowledge is being shared and the skill passed on. In my small town there was only one guy who worked on clocks and watches. He passed a while back and his kids continue with his jewelry store but they now send out watches and clocks to another business as none of his kids learned how to do it.
xutopia2 hours ago
I live in Quebec and this is the first time I hear about it.
whynotmaybe12 hours ago
I discovered this school right after discovering the Richard Mille clock in Quebec City [1] because the school is responsible for maintaining the clock.
1. https://www.ville.quebec.qc.ca/en/apropos/portrait/attraits/...
throwatdem1231112 hours ago
Maybe I will take up watchmaking when I get sick of AI slop programming and offshore morons going wild with a Claude subscription.
ggm10 hours ago
If you read about Harrison's Chronometers you read of Rupert T. Gould who suffered a Nervous Breakdown, and it is said fell into watch repair as therapy, bringing them back to life.
ElenaDaibunny12 hours ago
kid me thought AI would replace people doing insanely precise hand work. turns out it replaced me writing emails, and this school's still going strong after 80 years. lmao we got played
throwatdem1231112 hours ago
AI was supposed to do my laundry so that I could make art and code for fun but now the AI is coding and making art while I do laundry.
fragmede2 hours ago
it's a funny meme but it's because software can iterate faster than hardware. Give it a few years for robot maids to come out that can do your laundry, then we'll see society upturn.
DigiEggz11 hours ago
Profound and painful statement.
ElenaDaibunny11 hours ago
yep,sci-fi really got this one wrong lol.
dghlsakjg11 hours ago
Give the Chinese some time.
They are doing incredible things with world models, and have an economy that really could do incredible things with robots wired to effective world models.
It won't surprise me at all if in 10 years LLMs are less of a big deal than world models
ButlerianJihad13 hours ago
Yes, but has it taken a licking?
rohitsriram11 hours ago
[flagged]
Ozzie-D14 hours ago
[flagged]
pizzaballs7 hours ago
Enjoy till ai with robot arm take your job..
