floitsch2 days ago
Pretty impressive.
When I published Grisu (Google double-conversion), it was multiple times faster than the existing algorithms. I knew that there was still room for improvement, but I was at most expecting a factor 2 or so. Six times faster is really impressive.
vitaut2 days ago
Thank you! It means a lot coming from you, Grisu was the first algorithm that I implemented =). (I am the author of the blog post.)
nhatchera day ago
This blows my mind TBH. I used to say a few years back that Ryu is my favorite modern algorithm but it felt so complicated. Your C implentation almost feels... simple!
Congratulations, can't wait to have some time to study this further
vitauta day ago
Thank you! The simplicity is mostly thanks to Schubfach although I did simplify it a bit more. Unfortunately the paper makes it appear somewhat complex because of all the talk about generic bases and Java workarounds.
nhatcher3 hours ago
Quick question, if you are still around :).
I have been doing some tests. Is it correct to assume that it converts 1.0 to "0.000000000000001e+15".
Is there a test suite it is passing?
vitaut26 minutes ago
It converts 1.0 to "1.e-01" which reminds me to remove the trailing decimal point =). dtoa-benchmark tests that the algorithm produces valid results on its dataset.
adgjlsfhk1a day ago
I've just started a Julia port and I think it will be even cleaner than the C version (mostly because Julia gives you a first class (U)Int128 and count leading zeros (and also better compile time programming that lets you skip on writing the first table out explicitly).
vitauta day ago
Cool, please share once it is complete.
C++ also provides countl_zero: https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/numeric/countl_zero.html. We currently use our own for maximum portability.
I considered computing the table at compile time (you can do it in C++ using constexpr) but decided against it not to add compile-time overhead, however small. The table never changes so I'd rather not make users pay for recomputing it every time.
nhatchera day ago
Oh wow, I would love to see that if you can share it :)
adgjlsfhk1a day ago
Once I finish it, I'll be PRing to the Julia repo (to replace the current Ryu version), and I'll drop a link here.
amlutoa day ago
I read the post and the companion post:
https://vitaut.net/posts/2025/smallest-dtoa/
And there’s one detail I found confusing. Suppose I go through the steps to find the rounding interval and determine that k=-3, so there is at most one integer multiple of 10^-3 in the interval (and at least one multiple of 10^-4). For the sake of argument, let’s say that -3 worked: m·10^-3 is in the interval.
Then, if m is not a multiple of 10, I believe that m·10^-3 is the right answer. But what if m is a multiple of 10? Then the result will be exactly equal, numerically, to the correct answer, but it will have trailing zeros. So maybe I get 7.460 instead of 7.46 (I made up this number and I have no idea whether any double exists gives this output.) Even though that 6 is definitely necessary (there is no numerically different value with decimal exponent greater than -3 that rounds correctly), I still want my formatter library to give me the shortest decimal representation of the result.
Is this impossible for some reason? Is there logic hiding in the write function to simplify the answer? Am I missing something?
vitauta day ago
This is possible and the trailing zeros are indeed removed (with the exponent adjusted accordingly) in the write function. The post mentions removing trailing zeros without going into details but it's a pretty interesting topic and was recently changed to use lzcnt/bsr instead of a lookup table.
NovemberWhiskey2 days ago
When I saw the title here, my first thought was “wow, these RISC-V ISA extensions are getting out of hand”
HexDecOctBin2 days ago
It seems that most research effort goes into better dtoa, and not enough in a better atod. There are probably a dozen dtoa algorithms now, and (I think?) two for atod. Anyone know why?
vitaut2 days ago
Good question. I am not familiar with string-to-double algorithms but maybe it's an easier problem? double-to-string is relatively complex, people even doing PhD in this area. There is also some inherent asymmetry: formatting is more common than parsing.
dtolnaya day ago
In implementing Rust's serde_json library, I have dealt with both string-to-double and double-to-string. Of the two, I found string-to-double was more complex.
Unlike formatting, correct parsing involves high precision arithmetic.
Example: the IEEE 754 double closest to the exact value "0.1" is 7205759403792794*2^-56, which has an exact value of A (see below). The next higher IEEE 754 double has an exact value of C (see below). Exactly halfway between these values is B=(A+C)/2.
A=0.1000000000000000055511151231257827021181583404541015625
B=0.100000000000000012490009027033011079765856266021728515625
C=0.10000000000000001942890293094023945741355419158935546875
0.1000000000000000124900090270330110797658562660217285156249
0.1000000000000000124900090270330110797658562660217285156251
nlya day ago
I guess one aspect of it is that in really high performance fields where you're taking in lots of stringy real inputs (FIX messages coming from trading venues for example, containing prices and quantities) you would simply parse directly to a fixed point decimal format, and only accept fixed (not scientific) notation inputs. Except for trailing or leading zeros there is no normalisation to be done.
Parsing a decimal ASCII string to a decimal value already optimizes well, because you can scale each digit by it's power of 10 in parallel and just add up the result.
vitauta day ago
> Unlike formatting, correct parsing involves high precision arithmetic.
Formatting also requires high precision arithmetic unless you disallow user-specified precision. That's why {fmt} still has an implementation of Dragon4 as a fallback for such silly cases.
andrepda day ago
For those wishing to read up on this subject, an excellent starting point is this comprehensive post by one of the main contributors of the fast algorithm currently used in core:
https://old.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/omelz4/making_rust_fl...
mdfa day ago
> formatting is more common than parsing.
Is it, though? It's genuinely hard for me to tell.
There's both serialization and deserialization of data sets with, e.g., JSON including floating point numbers, implying formatting and parsing, respectively.
Source code (including unit tests etc.) with hard-coded floating point values is compiled, linted, automatically formatted again and again, implying lots of parsing.
Code I usually work with ingests a lot of floating point numbers, but whatever is calculated is seldom displayed as formatted strings and more often gets plotted on graphs.
adrian_ba day ago
For serialization and deserialization, when the goal is to produce strings that will be read again by a computer, I consider the use of decimal numbers as a serious mistake.
The conversion to string should produce a hexadecimal floating-point number (e.g. with the "a" or "A" printf conversion specifier of recent C library implementations), not a decimal number, so that both serialization and deserialization are trivial and they cannot introduce any errors.
Even if a human inspects the strings produced in this way, comparing numbers to see which is greater or less and examining the order of magnitude can be done as easy as with decimal numbers. Nobody will want to do exact arithmetic computations mentally with such numbers.
vitauta day ago
Think about things like logging and all the uses of printf which are not parsed back. But I agree that parsing is extremely common, just not the same level.
Scaevolusa day ago
Is the large significands table (~19KB) an issue for cache contention in practical use, or are only a small range of significands generally accessed?
vitauta day ago
It depends on the input distribution, specifically exponents. It is also possible to compress the table at the cost of additional computation using the method from Dragonbox.
mulle_nat2 days ago
Thank you for the code. I could port this easily to C and it solved a lot of portability issues for me.
vitauta day ago
I've added a C implementation in https://github.com/vitaut/zmij/blob/main/zmij.c in case you are interested.
mulle_nata day ago
Nice, but it's too late I needed a different API for future use in my custom sprintf so I made mulle-dtostr (https://github.com/mulle-core/mulle-dtostr). On my machine (AMD) that benchmarked in a quick try quite a bit faster even, but I was just checking that it didn't regress too badly and didn't look at it closer.
andrepd2 days ago
Very interesting!
I wonder how Teju Jaguá compares. I don't see it in the C++ benchmark repo you linked and whose graph you included.
I have contributed an implementation in Rust :) https://crates.io/crates/teju it includes benchmarks which compare it vs Ryu and vs Rust's stdlib, and the readme shows a graph with some test cases. It's quite easy to run if you're interested!
vitaut2 days ago
I am not sure how it compares but I did use one idea from Cassio's talk on Teju:
> A more interesting improvement comes from a talk by Cassio Neri Fast Conversion From Floating Point Numbers. In Schubfach, we look at four candidate numbers. The first two, of which at most one is in the rounding interval, correspond to a larger decimal exponent. The other two, of which at least one is in the rounding interval, correspond to the smaller exponent. Cassio’s insight is that we can directly construct a single candidate from the upper bound in the first case.
andrepd2 days ago
Indeed! I saw that you linked to Neri's work, so you were aware of Teju Jaguá. I might make a pull request to add it to the benchmark repo when I have some time :)
Another nice thing about your post is mentioning the "shell" of the algorithm, that is, actually translating the decimal significand and exponent into a string (as opposed to the "core", turning f * 2^e into f' * 10^e'). A decent chunk of the overall time is spent there, so it's worth optimising it as well.
vlovich123a day ago
Any ideas why Rust’s stdlib hasn’t adopted faster implementations?
pitaja day ago
I think code size is one notable reason
vitauta day ago
I am pretty sure Dragonbox is smaller than Ryu in terms of code size because it can compress the tables.
Cold_Miserable2 days ago
Already done ages ago. Nothing more of interest.
The bottleneck are the 3 conditionals: - positive or negative - positive or negative exponent, x > 10.0 - correction for 1.xxxxx * 2^Y => fract(log10(2^Y)) 1.xxxxxxxx > 10.0